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quality posts: 14 Private Messages WootBot

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Monticello Vineyards Napa Cabernet (3)

Speed to First Woot:
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First Sucker:
MarkDaSpark
Last Wooter to Woot:
jimjacks66
Last Purchase:
2 years ago
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Quality Posts


Cesare


quality posts: 1619 Private Messages Cesare

Monticello Vineyards 15 Year Anniversary Jefferson Cuvée Cabernet 3-Pack
$64.99 (Normally $122.00) 47% off List Price
1998 Monticello Vineyards Jefferson Cuvée Cabernet Sauvignon, Napa Valley
CT link above

Winery website

-il Cesare
Sole Absolute Triple
Exalted High Tastemaster Supreme
“In the entire world there are only a few sounds that bring joy to all but the most jaded. One is the murmur of a kitten purring. Another is the thwack of a well-pitched baseball hitting a perfectly swung bat. And the third is the pop of a cork being pulled from a bottle of wine.” —George Taber

Cesare


quality posts: 1619 Private Messages Cesare

Really like this winery. Was first introduced to them via Woot a few years ago and have since visited twice after the last two rpm tours. So I was very excited to find a bottle of this to try earlier.

At first this was a little tight and need to be woken up from it's sleep. But a little air in the glass (no decanter) helped it come alive.
Pretty aromatic nose with some nice bright cherry fruit and alcohol. Almost kind of a candy smell but not jammy. Hint of earthiness in the background.
Tastes very different than it smells. Restrained, not too fruity, well integrated - smooth and silky. Medium bodied with good structure. Not disjointed in any way. Quite a bit of acid and great with food. No oak. Slightly hot at the back (but this blew off with time and air later). Decent finish, not great but not bad.

After a few hours of being opened but kept corked it changed. The nose kept the cherry fruit but added some funky poopy pinot noir-ish type aroma and dropped the alcohol. Very interesting. Tasted as it did earlier just more together, no alcohol, better longer sweet finish.
I kept half the bottle to try again tonight so we shall see if anything is different.

This is a great price for a nice aged cab. Held up well all this time and still has life left in it. Not a typical modern Napa fruity oaky vanilla bomb so that makes sense.

-il Cesare
Sole Absolute Triple
Exalted High Tastemaster Supreme
“In the entire world there are only a few sounds that bring joy to all but the most jaded. One is the murmur of a kitten purring. Another is the thwack of a well-pitched baseball hitting a perfectly swung bat. And the third is the pop of a cork being pulled from a bottle of wine.” —George Taber

cortot20


quality posts: 142 Private Messages cortot20

I had one of these fall out of the sky and into my cellar.

These are tonights notes.

Cork broke in half despite careful extraction, it was on its way to crumbly but came out clean in two pieces. Heavy sediment on the cork and neck. Poured into decanter slowly fearing heavy sediment but found only fine sediment in the very bottom which was captured in the shoulder of the bottle.
Wine was clear with a medium red rim and deep red core. Legs were very visible and defined by large drips that remained for some time.

Initial glass was after 15 minutes in the decanter and seemed very closed, this surprised me since I figured that a 15 year old cab would show more initially. A swirl brought out some red fruit, leather and eucalyptus. I usually don't pick up much in the way of ancillary flavors but I found these to be quite prominent.
On the tongue it's definitely medium bodied, this is not a big napa cab. At least not at this stage in its life. The wine is ultra smooth, not a jagged edge on it, my wife remarked that she would drink it and she really dislikes red wine. The finish is short and somewhat unremarkable.
After an hour later and with only a 1/3 glass left this wine seemed to explode with fruit. It really opened up and started to show dark cherries and raspberries. It became a completely different animal. I had two separate people experience this and so it confirms that this wine needs about an hour of air to get the full potential this wine has to offer. I would have loved to see where it was headed but an hour and half post pop it was all gone.

Initially this wine was a disappointment to me, I had never had this winery's cab in its youth so I didn't know what to expect but found it a pleasure to drink due to its smoothness but rather unremarkable. But the unexpected explosion of fruit makes this not only much more enjoyable but also much more interesting. The finish also improved remarkably with time.

I really have no idea how to price a bottle with this much age from a winery I have never heard of but I would happily pay $25-30 a bottle for it. I am a cheapskate though.

CT

joelsisk


quality posts: 9 Private Messages joelsisk

Had this a few days ago.

Sight
brick red with just a hint of orange at the edges

upon pop and pour, some significant chunks of sediment up by the cork

Smell
very light, some dust, some cigar box/cedar

taste
initial pop and pour was light sour cherry with not much going on. After a few minutes, opens up with some additional cigar box/cedar notes, and after 30 mins some of the tannins still show. Good acidity still. Some darker notes start to show as it rests. Complimented the pot roast (made with a sunce' merlot), helped cut through some of the greasy goodness.

finish
started fairly quick, after a bit of glass time, lasted a bit longer.

Overall

A nice aged cab. Possibly a bit over the hill, but still a showing of tannins after 10 minutes in the glass. Certainly enjoyable, but probably not much left in it. I didn't read the review from the initial 81 Wine Spectator score upon release, but would be good to take a flyer even just to experience some of the flavor profiles that a 15 year old Napa Cab (from an "average" year) may express.


SWMBO - It had the big bold flavors that I like. (she likes petite sirah and cab franc) It went REALLY well with the meat. It did not dry my mouth out the way some reds do. tasted like a "real" cab. not a blend. A strong, meaty red wine I really enjoyed it and would recommend it.

FIL - not too dry (he doesn't like "very dry reds"). nice, good, got better after a bit of time (10 mins in glass)


ETA: I did not notice the huge change after an hour. I noticed a significant change after 10-20 mins of glass time (in reidel sommelier bordeaux). Was mostly the same 30-40 mins later.

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 181 Private Messages MarkDaSpark

IIRC, when we had aged Cabs at TMR's Chicago blowout far too many years ago (4 years?), he and PS decanted them for a while (1/2 to 1 hour?).

Have to see if I can find the thread.

Perhaps RPM can pop in and verify about letting aged cabs air a bit (but not too long!).


Edit: Chicago W.W Tasting #9 - You Gotta Be At Least 20 To Attend This Party!!! (1/24/09) -- The Chicago gathering thread for 20 year old wines.


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 181 Private Messages MarkDaSpark



Courtesy of CJ:

cjsiege wrote:List of previous WW gatherings by area. Great reading and great examples of how to set up a Get-Together Thread.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Upcoming Woot Wine Gatherings…All The News for the week of February 17th.

Are you planning to Open That Bottle on Feb 23rd???

February 2013
2/22: 2013 Dark & Delicious (Alameda, CA)
2/23 - 2/25: 2013 D&D Napa/Sonoma Weekend
2/23: NoVA/DC #28: Sweet and Sour

March
3/16: NYC #21: Cupcakes
3/22: Minnesota #20: Visitors from Afar
3/30: SoCal #24: Aged Zins
TBD: Colorado/Wyoming #?

April
4/19: Ohio Wine.Woot Table at the Wine Dinner

Pending
TBD: NYC Tasting #??: A Tribute (interest thread)
TBD: NorCal: Volcanic Terroir and/or Eastern European Finds
TBD: NorCal: Wheelbarrow o' Wine
TBD: Dallas #11
TBD: Arizona Verde Valley Winery Weekend


No events in your area??? Start one! Create an interest thread in the World of Wine Woot Community Tab.




So join or create a WW Gathering!


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 181 Private Messages MarkDaSpark

Reminder: Don't expect to pop and pour these wines. Aged wines will have some sediment in them, as Cortot noticed in his excellent review.


1) You should let these sit for at least a day, if not a week in the upright position to get the sediment to the bottom, prior to opening.

2) You will need a decanter and a funnel with a filter (Metrokane has one), but you really shouldn't use one with an aerator on it. Something similar to this one, since it's a straight funnel without aeration. (paging WD!)

3) You will also need a light source for when you pour the wine, so that you can see when the sediment gets close to the neck of the bottle as you pour.

4) Pouring slow is the key, so as not to stir up the sediment. You want your wine clear.


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

cmaldoon


quality posts: 62 Private Messages cmaldoon
MarkDaSpark wrote:IIRC, when we had aged Cabs at TMR's Chicago blowout far too many years ago (4 years?), he and PS decanted them for a while (1/2 to 1 hour?).



While I am certainly not an expert in such things, I have had a reasonable share of aged cabs and have found that if one does a pop and pour on a middle aged cab 10-20 years one can get 1 of 3 sets of flavors:

1) Mmmmm: congrats, this one drinks well on a pop and pour, enjoy. It will probably taste even better in 30-60 min.

2) Meh: your wine has not opened yet, wasn't a good quality wine to begin with, or is flawed. Wait 30-60 min and try again. Your wine will likely have significantly more flavor. If after 2 hours it still isn't there, it's most likely an off bottle or an off wine.

3) Yech: your wine has reductive characteristics to it or is flawed. Wait 30-60 min and try again. Your wine will likely have come out of its ugly duckling shell and shown itself for the swan it is. If not in 1 hour, try 2. If not 2, leave it overnight. If it still tastes awful then it is certainly flawed. (The longest I have had was a Petite Sirah that took 2 hours. It was horrific upon opening and at 30 min. I almost poured it down the drain. After 2 hours it was a stunning wine)

Notice a theme? I suggest planning to open a bottle in this age range 30 or more min before serving and decanting it (at very least pour it into a clean pitcher then back into the bottle). Leaving it in an open but unpoured bottle does not allow enough gas transfer. I generally taste upon opening out of curiosity but then set it aside.

Anyway, not an expert, just sharing my novice experience.

2014 - 20 Btl. Fjellene (10 bot), Urraca Chard (10 bot)
Last purchase: 5/3/14

2013 - 75 btl. 2012 - 98 btl. 2011 - 112 btl. 2010 - 30 btl.
My Cellar

jnacey


quality posts: 0 Private Messages jnacey

Have been waiting a while for a great napa cab. Unfortunately, 1998 was one of the worst vintages for Napa Cabernet in the past 25 years. It had an 84 vintage rating from Wine Spectator and their general drinking window says these wines are past their peak. I have not tried this winery before, and I know there are exceptions, but I will pass on this one.

hinrgman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages hinrgman

My original response was to pull the trigger. The more I research this wine the less I like it. The winery doesn't sell it any more. 2001 is their oldest library wine now. '98 was not a good vintage in Napa.
Although this offer will ship to NJ.

fredrinaldi


quality posts: 35 Private Messages fredrinaldi

Interesting comments, glad I read them, usually a Cab I pull the trigger, will wait and continue to read the reviews, thanks to all reviewers.

North316


quality posts: 107 Private Messages North316

Once again WD/TT/Inky(Where are you?!?), I would suggest putting a (3) after the title on the home page. I pulled this offering up on my mobile app this morning and simply saw the title and the price (pictures are slow to load), and said $70 for one bottle? Guess I don't have to check woot today. I did check, and realized this was three bottles, but others may not.

My CT
"Trust your homies on the net", Clark Smith.
R.I.P. Inkycatz - Feb. 2013

rlmanzo


quality posts: 23 Private Messages rlmanzo

Dear Woot,

These reviews are great and remind me of the halcyon "lab rat" days...

That said, how does one get on the special list of tasters?

Respectfully submitted,
Rlmanzo

Is it broke or just fractured?

North316


quality posts: 107 Private Messages North316
rlmanzo wrote:Dear Woot,

These reviews are great and remind me of the halcyon "lab rat" days...

That said, how does one get on the special list of tasters?

Respectfully submitted,
Rlmanzo



There is no such list, this list does not exist....

If, however, there was some such list, I would believe that said list would be populated based on active participation in the forums.

My CT
"Trust your homies on the net", Clark Smith.
R.I.P. Inkycatz - Feb. 2013

North316


quality posts: 107 Private Messages North316

Just a side comment, for all you CostCo shoppers out there. I think "Kirkland" stole their label from these guys. Maybe I'm losing it, but they seem very similar.

My CT
"Trust your homies on the net", Clark Smith.
R.I.P. Inkycatz - Feb. 2013

ThunderThighs


quality posts: 565 Private Messages ThunderThighs

Staff

North316 wrote:Once again WD/TT/Inky(Where are you?!?), I would suggest putting a (3) after the title on the home page. I pulled this offering up on my mobile app this morning and simply saw the title and the price (pictures are slow to load), and said $70 for one bottle? Guess I don't have to check woot today. I did check, and realized this was three bottles, but others may not.


Thanks. I'll send it in. We have a very short character limit on the main page so it may not have fit.



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chipgreen


quality posts: 189 Private Messages chipgreen

The other day I was researching a specific wine when I stumbled across an entry in a wine blog from an old-time wooter, loweel. It links to a page which describes the slow oxygenation method for opening old wines, aka the Audouze method.

Thought this might be useful for those contemplating today's offer.

rlmanzo


quality posts: 23 Private Messages rlmanzo
North316 wrote:There is no such list, this list does not exist....

If, however, there was some such list, I would believe that said list would be populated based on active participation in the forums.



I'll do my best!

Is it broke or just fractured?

jhkey


quality posts: 51 Private Messages jhkey
chipgreen wrote:The other day I was researching a specific wine when I stumbled across an entry in a wine blog from an old-time wooter, loweel. It links to a page which describes the slow oxygenation method for opening old wines, aka the Audouze method.

Thought this might be useful for those contemplating today's offer.



Interesting. I bet that takes a lot of practice to get right...

"I double the doctor's recommendation of a glass and a half of wine a day and even treble it with a friend."
- Thomas Jefferson (CT)

chipgreen


quality posts: 189 Private Messages chipgreen
jhkey wrote:Interesting. I bet that takes a lot of practice to get right...

I know, it's pretty much the "open it up and leave it on the counter overnight" method but I thought that the "slow oxygenation is better than decanting" takeaway was worth it.

shencken


quality posts: 0 Private Messages shencken

I think its poor practice for it not to be disclosed when reviewers receive free bottles. The fact that the origin of these bottles is conspicuously absent from the reviews would lead me to believe they are told not to discuss this.

I don't think I'll be buying any more wine here until woot changes that practice.

klezman


quality posts: 122 Private Messages klezman

I haven't had this wine but I've had other 1998 Napa Cabs in the semi-recent past. I'm no expert, but I enjoyed them all. To the point where I almost automatically pulled the trigger on this one before remembering I'm on a SIWBM. I might pick up a set to have at the office for happy hour, though.

2014: 28 bottles. Last wine.woot: Scott Harvey Red Re-Mix
2013: 66 bottles, 2012: 91 bottles, 2011: 92 bottles, 2010: 74 bottles, 2009: 30 bottles, 2008: 3 bottles My CT

kylemittskus


quality posts: 230 Private Messages kylemittskus
shencken wrote:I think its poor practice for it not to be disclosed when reviewers receive free bottles. The fact that the origin of these bottles is conspicuously absent from the reviews would lead me to believe they are told not to discuss this.

I don't think I'll be buying any more wine here until woot changes that practice.



I'm sending you a PM.

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

sdfreedive


quality posts: 24 Private Messages sdfreedive
shencken wrote:I think its poor practice for it not to be disclosed when reviewers receive free bottles. The fact that the origin of these bottles is conspicuously absent from the reviews would lead me to believe they are told not to discuss this.

I don't think I'll be buying any more wine here until woot changes that practice.



Id like to find out to if the faux rats are members of the winery clubs or are just picked. And if picked why they were chosen.

btphillips


quality posts: 4 Private Messages btphillips
shencken wrote:I think its poor practice for it not to be disclosed when reviewers receive free bottles. The fact that the origin of these bottles is conspicuously absent from the reviews would lead me to believe they are told not to discuss this.
I don't think I'll be buying any more wine here until woot changes that practice.



I may be wrong, but I think all reviewers receive free bottles. At least I don't see RP shelling out millions/year to do all the WA reviews.

kylemittskus


quality posts: 230 Private Messages kylemittskus

Let's establish something right now. No one is not being sent not free bottles from no one.

btphillips: you're absolutely correct.

Sdfreedive: pm for you.

And can we all stop threatening to leave if we don't like something. I mean, we're all in third grade, at least.

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

jhkey


quality posts: 51 Private Messages jhkey
chipgreen wrote:I know, it's pretty much the "open it up and leave it on the counter overnight" method but I thought that the "slow oxygenation is better than decanting" takeaway was worth it.



I wasn't knocking the article, I think it makes a great point and I'm glad you posted it. Just being a bit snarky about the method.

"I double the doctor's recommendation of a glass and a half of wine a day and even treble it with a friend."
- Thomas Jefferson (CT)

jhkey


quality posts: 51 Private Messages jhkey
btphillips wrote:I may be wrong, but I think all reviewers receive free bottles. At least I don't see RP shelling out millions/year to do all the WA reviews.



Bingo.

"I double the doctor's recommendation of a glass and a half of wine a day and even treble it with a friend."
- Thomas Jefferson (CT)

mschauber


quality posts: 40 Private Messages mschauber

This offer looks interesting, but the comments about 1998 are keeping me from pulling the trigger at this point.

Too bad there isn't a Presidents Day moratorium on shipping charges ;)

--
Hey you, out there in the cold; Getting lonely, getting old; Can you feel me? - Pink Floyd/Roger Waters
My CT

kylemittskus


quality posts: 230 Private Messages kylemittskus
jhkey wrote:Bingo.



Don't forget the advertisements that are bought and then the wines are scored. Although those two events are completely unrelated, I'm sure.

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

mschauber


quality posts: 40 Private Messages mschauber
btphillips wrote:I may be wrong, but I think all reviewers receive free bottles. At least I don't see RP shelling out millions/year to do all the WA reviews.



And I believe wholeheartedly that the reviews we're getting/posting here are completely honest. That, in my opinion, is the most important thing. There are no added benefits or repercussions for specific leaning reviews.

--
Hey you, out there in the cold; Getting lonely, getting old; Can you feel me? - Pink Floyd/Roger Waters
My CT

mdctreeguy


quality posts: 0 Private Messages mdctreeguy

Why not use a filter with an aerator? I was just given one as a gift, and so far I like it (pop, pour, drink). Does it stir up sediment or something? I'm not a big wine drinker, but I do enjoy the occasional red (really don't like white).

-Mark

.

MarkDaSpark wrote:Reminder: Don't expect to pop and pour these wines. Aged wines will have some sediment in them, as Cortot noticed in his excellent review.


1) You should let these sit for at least a day, if not a week in the upright position to get the sediment to the bottom, prior to opening.

2) You will need a decanter and a funnel with a filter (Metrokane has one), but you really shouldn't use one with an aerator on it. Something similar to this one, since it's a straight funnel without aeration. (paging WD!)

3) You will also need a light source for when you pour the wine, so that you can see when the sediment gets close to the neck of the bottle as you pour.

4) Pouring slow is the key, so as not to stir up the sediment. You want your wine clear.



kylemittskus


quality posts: 230 Private Messages kylemittskus
mdctreeguy wrote:Why not use a filter with an aerator? I was just given one as a gift, and so far I like it (pop, pour, drink). Does it stir up sediment or something? I'm not a big wine drinker, but I do enjoy the occasional red (really don't like white).

-Mark



Older wine is generally more delicate so you wouldn't want to use a Vinturi or the like.

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

jhkey


quality posts: 51 Private Messages jhkey
mdctreeguy wrote:Why not use a filter with an aerator? I was just given one as a gift, and so far I like it (pop, pour, drink). Does it stir up sediment or something? I'm not a big wine drinker, but I do enjoy the occasional red (really don't like white).

-Mark
.


An aerator is fine for younger wines, but older wines are fragile, and an aerator can damage them. They don't need the same amount of air as a younger wine. When I say "fragile" what I mean is that they can easily fall apart, and the agitation of an aerator would do just that. I have had older wines that needed 1/2 hour to open up, drank beautifully for about an hour and then started to fall apart. If I had used an aerator, the wine would have gone straight to the fall apart phase and I would not have had the pleasure of enjoying the greatness of the wine.

"I double the doctor's recommendation of a glass and a half of wine a day and even treble it with a friend."
- Thomas Jefferson (CT)

rjquillin


quality posts: 174 Private Messages rjquillin
sdfreedive wrote:Id like to find out to if the faux rats are members of the winery clubs or are just picked. And if picked why they were chosen.

PM for you.

CT

Winedavid39


quality posts: 200 Private Messages Winedavid39

Guest Blogger

shencken wrote:I think its poor practice for it not to be disclosed when reviewers receive free bottles. The fact that the origin of these bottles is conspicuously absent from the reviews would lead me to believe they are told not to discuss this.

I don't think I'll be buying any more wine here until woot changes that practice.



i don't believe you have the benefit of wine.woot history to factor into your opinion.

that's about all i can say.

polarbear22


quality posts: 35 Private Messages polarbear22

Remember that vintage ratings are very general. A poor vintage means it is a lot harder to make a great wine.

Out of a small vertical of Phelps Cabernet, I recall the 1998 being very good. I liked it better than the 1997, which was the better vintage. I've also had a 1998 Corison that was very good.

So don't paint with a broad brush. I suspect that is part of the reason we have tasting reports on this wine. I personally will rely more on what they are reporting than on the vintage rating.

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neilfindswine


quality posts: 170 Private Messages neilfindswine

Guest Blogger

'tis true that '98 was an average year, though there were winemakers that coaxed some good wines in spite of it; the good ones usually do.

I tasted this at the winery a couple of weeks ago, and it had been open about 2 hours. As usual, I didn't take notes, but I can say that I was pretty impressed by how much fruit was left on this 98 Napa Cab. Nice cherry fruit, surrounded by the secondary characteristics that I love so much in aged cab... leather, tea, cedar, etc.

I took the bottle with me and finished it with dinner. It had opened up nicely and went well with food.

It's not often that aged Napa Cab can be found at this price, and when you do it's usually at an auction, where the source and storage are of concern. These have been safely stored in the winery's library for the last 13 or so years, waiting for this day.

I report to winedavid39...
...I like getting PM's from wannabe rodents...

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 181 Private Messages MarkDaSpark
chipgreen wrote:The other day I was researching a specific wine when I stumbled across an entry in a wine blog from an old-time wooter, loweel. It links to a page which describes the slow oxygenation method for opening old wines, aka the Audouze method.

Thought this might be useful for those contemplating today's offer.



The issue is that the wine is normally kept at "cellar" temp (i.e., around 55°) not room temp for this method to work. Most people don't have a built-in wine cellar, and not realizing it, leave it at room temp.

Plus, as noted, you need lots of patience. I believe iByron had a bottle of Tannat (South American grape similar in quality to PS) for several days before it opened this way.


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.