Pavi Napa Valley 2005 Dolcetto 4-Pack
$67.99 $̶1̶1̶5̶.̶7̶6̶ 41% off List Price
2005 Pavi Napa Valley Dolcetto

Winery website

What a coincidence, just had this wine tonight.
Nice clear red color. Smells fruity and hot. Candied cherry, strawberry, with smoke.
Tastes fruity, a little hot, medium body, no tannin, good acid. Smokey but not earthy. Short finish.
Reminds me of a pinot noir with some syrah.
Good food wine, went well with the sausage rigatoni I made.

Looks like it would be a good wine. However, I don't understand the list price shown because at the winery link it's $24 per bottle.

Winery website shows $20 for the current release ('06) and $24 for the '03 to '05. FWIW it is listed as library. Not sure if it was also released at $20 initially. Also no will call pickup from this winery, shipping only, so woot shipping is an advantage.

Because of Cesare I am a first sucker

This is another o the wines we tasted at the Chicago WOOT gathering last Friday night. I tried sooooo hard to stay up until midnight to post, but I apparently dosed off for a bit.

I’ve not had much, if any, Dolcetto in the past, to the best of my recollection, so I have no particular memories to compare this wine to.

Nose: Funk, which I had a hard time getting past initially. Not bad funk, just….funk, which eventually dissipated with ample swirling. The nose then became a little smoky with a hint of very dark fruit (dark cherry, blackberry, maybe prune or fig). On the palate, it was mostly earthy with some leather. I didn’t pick up much fruit on the palate. I’d call it a light to medium body…tannins were quite smooth. I believe jmdavidson said the bottle had probably been open for a few hours at this point; it was not decanted. This would probably pair well with a nice Bolognese or my polenta with sausage and mushrooms.

I’ll also add the same disclaimer as I did to the previous wine tasted at the Chicago gathering: At the time of the tasting, I had been struggling with a cold/sinus issues for a few weeks, so my nose/palate may be a bit dulled.

By a random twist of fate, I also happened to have this wine tonight. Opened it for a dinner party after drinking a very rich 2005 Napa Cabernet Sauvignon and eating Filet Mignons, so that may have colored our palates a bit.

My experience with Italian varietals is minimal, so I'm a néophyte when it comes to Dolcetto.

I agree with Cesare that this wine fits more in the Pinot Noir realm (and also second the thought of Pinot Noir with some Syrah). Medium to light bodied, heavy on the cherry tones. And by cherry, I don't want you to think cherry cola like a RRV pinot, I mean straight up cherry with the mildest undertones of licorice.

I had a difficult time reading much off the nose on this except for a light cherry and wax smell. Almost like a cherry candle.

Definitely decent acid, but it also had a bit of a bite to it. Some of my dining companions described it as bitter, but I wouldn't go that far.

I'm curious how much more fruit would show on a younger vintage of this wine. I doubt there'd be much to gain from cellaring this any more at this point, so I'd put this in the drink soonish category.

I also agree that this is a wine that is meant to be enjoyed with food rather than solo.

redwinefan wrote:
*snip*

I'm curious how much more fruit would show on a younger vintage of this wine. I doubt there'd be much to gain from cellaring this any more at this point, so I'd put this in the drink soonish category.

Earlier this evening, after I wrote up my notes on this I spent about 5 minutes Googling Dolcetto, just out of curiosity. It would seem that most recommend not aging....consuming fairly soon after release (at least the Italian Dolcetto from the Piedmont region). Interestingly, the Pavi website has it in their Library, vintages 1998-2005, with 2006 as theircurren t release. With 2006 as the most recent vintage (released in Novemebr 2008), I wonder if they are still making Dolcetto? I also wonder what this would have been like a bit younger....

ThunderThighs wrote:The list price now includes estimates taxes and shipping by the winery.

If that's true, then the percent off "list" is inflated (misleading) since it doesn't include Woot shipping. In this case it would be just under 37% off from "list".

Why fudge the numbers? Let price be price.

I recognize that Napa isn't Piedmont and wines will always be riper in CA - but looking at the numbers, don't the alcohol and brix #s seem quite high for a dolcetto?

Good point, if the winery price is all in, the Woot price comparison should be all in too....although that would differ if you bought more than one offer...but my guess is most purchases are one offer, and apples should be compared to apples.

woottoady wrote:If that's true, then the percent off "list" is inflated (misleading) since it doesn't include Woot shipping. In this case it would be just under 37% off from "list".

Why fudge the numbers? Let price be price.

kaolis wrote:Good point, if the winery price is all in, the Woot price comparison should be all in too....although that would differ if you bought more than one offer...but my guess is most purchases are one offer, and apples should be compared to apples.

WD has posted about this before and they actually include shipping MINUS $5 in the price so it is more apples to apples. Now there are a few assumptions about tax and shipping rates that go in but they are supposedly always erring on the low side.

Got it, thanks. I get the point of what they are doing but seems kind of messy. That being said I've only ordered a few things, and bottom line is everything I've ordered has been great and at a price I've been happy with.

cmaldoon wrote:WD has posted about this before and they actually include shipping MINUS $5 in the price so it is more apples to apples. Now there are a few assumptions about tax and shipping rates that go in but they are supposedly always erring on the low side.

I also tried this at the Chicago tasting last week. It did have some barnyard or old cellar smell on the initial nose. This did dissipate after a few swirls of the glass and then opened up to a red fruit and berry scent.

The initial taste did reinforce the red fruit characteristics of the nose, cranberry, cherry, etc. My issue is that this wine seemed to go bland, actually silent right in the middle and stayed quiet until a bit of bitterness and tannin came through on the end. I didn't perceive any fennel or black fruits that I usually get with other Dolcettos I've had in the past.

I'm not quite getting the reference to Pinot like some of the other tasters on this board unless they are referring to sub $10 brands. I stay away from those because I don't think of Pinot as a bargain wine. I know Dolcetto is a wine that is made for drinking young, this one just seemed to be too blase for me.

woottoady wrote:If that's true, then the percent off "list" is inflated (misleading) since it doesn't include Woot shipping. In this case it would be just under 37% off from "list".

Why fudge the numbers? Let price be price.

Couldn't agree with u more. First time this issue has hit the regular wine woot. There was a discussion of this last week on wine woot plus.

My preference is list price vs woot price... Period. We can calculate discount!

Thanks. Not a sucker! Smart person interested in different things.
Like the sucker who makes it!

Thanks for your interest. Website is under redesign. so not up to date. We are currently selling 07 with new release 08 next month.
And a website thats cleaned up!!

Thanks. We are still making dolcetto and love it. We are down to only 9 acres in the napa valley.
We love this style of wine, keeping in mind it is a style.
We are not looking to make a light style like a Beaujolais but looking for more structure etc. Something that is age worthly.In a lot of cases dolcetto will not see new oak and released early.Not what we are looking for. If you know dolcetto think Sandrone, Giacosa.
Brix is a part of it normally we look to 23-25 brix when picking. Its an interesting wine to grow. Big clusters that we need to look for balance. Like a zin cluster.

Cesare wrote:What a coincidence, just had this wine tonight.
Nice clear red color. Smells fruity and hot. Candied cherry, strawberry, with smoke.
Tastes fruity, a little hot, medium body, no tannin, good acid. Smokey but not earthy. Short finish.
Reminds me of a pinot noir with some syrah.
Good food wine, went well with the sausage rigatoni I made.

"Reminds me of a pinot noir with some syrah."
thanks I was on the fence, you just knocked me off,
Pass

Funbunny.
A lot of folks like to categorize styles to better know varieties.
I get a lot of comparison to Merlot, Zin,and pinot.
I think in general dolcetto meets in the middle of pinot and zin. A touch more elegance and finesse and then some ripe red fruits like zin.
I have never found our style to be merlot like but there are some italians that have a broader.
Keeping in mind that most dont age and we dont drink older dolcettos its an understanding as we see it age. Your comments are on point and mid palate. as wine ages we always look to the core but i do love the finish.

a varietal I've never tried from a great appellation and a convincing vintner's voicemail. Ok I'm in.

Third person to chime in after having tasted this at the Chicago gathering. Upon opening it, I found it to be a clear, burgundy color. The nose exhibited a funky, or musty, smell that I usually associate with some Italian varieties. As the evening wore on, this smell did go away. The initial taste was of a soft raspberry and cherry. On the swallow there was a little of an acidic finish. In some ways this reminded me of some barberas I've tasted. If you are looking for a soft fruited, lighter bodied, food friendly wine, this is it.

jmdavidson wrote:Third person to chime in after having tasted this at the Chicago gathering. Upon opening it, I found it to be a clear, burgundy color. The nose exhibited a funky, or musty, smell that I usually associate with some Italian varieties. As the evening wore on, this smell did go away. The initial taste was of a soft raspberry and cherry. On the swallow there was a little of an acidic finish. In some ways this reminded me of some barberas I've tasted. If you are looking for a soft fruited, lighter bodied, food friendly wine, this is it.

All these reports are very appreciated!

Thanks.
Glad you like the voicemail.
Simple. Im passionate about what I do and lucky to be doing it.
As a third generation winemaker and grower I hope I get it!!
This is my favorite wine to make and drink when I'm not making high end cabernets!

Hey everyone, can anyone tell me how wine.woot delivers their packages? Does it require signature? Does the exterior of the packaging indicate that it contains alcohol? If I'm at work, I don't want it to be left out to the neighborhood children to investigate. Any answers would be much appreciated, thank you! (P.S. I'm in VA if that matters at all.)

Loganschroeder wrote:Hey everyone, can anyone tell me how wine.woot delivers their packages? Does it require signature? Does the exterior of the packaging indicate that it contains alcohol? If I'm at work, I don't want it to be left out to the neighborhood children to investigate. Any answers would be much appreciated, thank you! (P.S. I'm in VA if that matters at all.)

Yep. You gotta sign for it, bro.

Love everyone's comments.
Thanks for bringing it!!

bobrush12866 wrote:Couldn't agree with u more. First time this issue has hit the regular wine woot. There was a discussion of this last week on wine woot plus.

My preference is list price vs woot price... Period. We can calculate discount!

I am glad this discussion has come up on the main wine woot page. I was part of the intitial discussion last week on Wine Woot Plus and have been wondering since why WineDavid has NOT brought it up on this forum. It is deceptive, IMHO, that the list price was changed without notifying the community. I can live with the change (though I prefer a straight up winery list price and nothing else) but find it deceptive that there was no mention of the change for all to see. My two cents. Now off to wait for the next offer. Peace.

I can't speak for others but the only wineries that ship to me with sales tax added are in my own state, OH.... and Scott Harvey for some reason. I would pay the state sales tax for wherever the wineries are located if I bought in person but then I wouldn't have shipping charges unless I didn't take the bottles with me. Still, I can appreciate what WD is trying to do here in showing "real world" savings with everything factored in. The factors won't be identical for everyone so it's not as easy as one size fits all.

Winedavid39 wrote:

Since the onset of posting the list price (June) i've pushed to include estimated winery sales tax (lowest) and estimated winery delivery charge (short distance) in the list price to better reflect the true savings by comparison. i think the previous method was really underestimating the savings opportunity. The new list price is more accurate, more transparent (and yes more compelling).

Already bought in on this wine as I am always game for some Italian or Italian style wines.

Along the lines of list price, I for one like the idea of including the shipping and taxes in the price. It shows what you would normally be paying.

Now will someone come over to my house and cook my something to eat with these when they arrive.

Just had 2 dozen raw oysters tonight.. yum yum.

I posted earlier on this, and get what you're trying to do. But truth be told, it is pretty deceptive. Yes, I said I was happy with previous purchases, very true. But I've been doing this for a bit. Thinking it through, this is not an apples to apples comparison..too many variables. It really does have the feel of trying to pull a fast one, particularly I would think for people that are not that in tune to the intricacies of taxes and shipping...again too many variables. And I'm not a kid, pushing 60 and been doing this for over 30 years...just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Cheers!

Winedavid39 wrote:HI and thanks for your candor.

We've tried to be very open about this change. In addition to the immediate hover description change, i notified all moderators and asked Cesare to post a stipulation when he volunteers to repost the deal (thanks Cesare). i really did not want to take away from the focus on the winery(s) day in the sun and thought it more appropriate to address in the other less winery centric forums.

Since the onset of posting the list price (June) i've pushed to include estimated winery sales tax (lowest) and estimated winery delivery charge (short distance) in the list price to better reflect the true savings by comparison. i think the previous method was really underestimating the savings opportunity. The new list price is more accurate, more transparent (and yes more compelling).

We understood this would be a lively topic and open to be discussed. i mean it's woot. We counted on it as a way to further illuminate the topic. I've tried to be quick in responding to the subject wherever it appears.

Deception is the opposite of our intent. Apologies to those who feel this way.