canonizer wrote:This has been covered in our forums before but, quickly, corked wines are ones that have been tainted by 2,4,6-trichloroanisole (TCA). These wines will range in smell from wet cardboard down to lacking in fruit.

Thanks for the clarification. I know about cork taint, but in the context seen here, I thought "corked" referred to when heat exposure pushed the cork out of the bottle a little bit (i.e., severely "cooked").

Am definitely interested in hearing from the other rats who ordered the Chardonnay. The rats are inherently biased in general, because they have already purchased the wine in question. That is to say, they were interested in the varietal and they *want* to like it since they now own some.

The chardonnay purchasers may not like merlot, as in CREIGHTONatNY's case. A review from someone like that is valuable, if to be taken with a grain of salt too.

Where are the other Chardonnay rats?

kurtswa wrote:Speaking of Merlot, I thought the recent Lange Twins Merlot offering was delicious. (actually really enjoyed both their Merlot and Cab).

Agreed on those, glad I went 3 on that offering as well and will go 3 again when they come back up...

i'm waiting for a lab review as well... I'm interested in a purchase but need to see a few more reviews first.

I have a local Wooter coming up to taste tomorrow - one extra rat... Everyone's waiting, kind of fun!

Lab Rat report update: Day 2

Well I just pulled the merlot out of the ‘fridge and poured it into my glass

W O W what a difference. I realize it’s only about 42-45 degrees but there’s no alcohol taste, the flavors are smooth and mellow. What comes through is black cherry, very slight currant and a twinge of red apple skin. Tannins are minor, mellow, and smooth throughout. This is not a big wine but it comes alive with the lower temp. I may even be in for one (or 2 or 3) for a cold summer refresher sort of drink. Cold, you can drink this as a stand alone. I’m impressed.

Disregard my comments from yesterday, but drink it cold

NedDawg wrote:Thanks for the clarification. I know about cork taint, but in the context seen here, I thought "corked" referred to when heat exposure pushed the cork out of the bottle a little bit (i.e., severely "cooked").

This brings to mind a question I have for all. Sometimes I have received a bottle with a little bit of detectable leakage... a drop or less of wine near the base of the foil. I have no way of knowing if there is any leakage that has not made its way from cork to base of foil. The question is this: Should foils be removed upon receipt? Does removing a foil prior to storage adversely affect the wine either short term or long term?

andyduncan wrote:Oh no, I saw those, but I figure if we bug SB enough he'll cave.

todd999430 wrote:i'm waiting for a lab review as well... I'm interested in a purchase but need to see a few more reviews first.

I second.

jwink wrote:Were your bottles shipped with the cardboard forms?

I've noticed recenlty that shipments have been packed with the "formed cardbord mash" versus the styrofoam forms used previously. Cardboard is a poor insulator and going back to the styrofoam may be required in the very cold and warm months of the year to provide insulation. The commenent of the gel packs being warmer than wine concerns me. I don't want to deal with the hassle of getting new bottles shipped therefore I (and what appears others) may have to stop purchases until the Fall....

Yep..the cardboard is what was used for my last 3-4 shipments. I think you hit the nail on the head ! Makes sense to me. Glad to hear Trent will use the insulated boxes. Thanks!!

More on a common question today -

Two shipments arrived today at the same time, both from the last woot-off: K Vitners Syrah (3 bottles)and the Ty Canton Cab(6 bottles).

The K Vitners bottles were warm to the touch - not hot, but warm enough for me to notice. The Tys are also warm, but not as much. (The Tys had freezer packets, the K Vitners did not.) Upon close inspection, all corks / foil appear fine (did not remove foil), except for 1 Ty bottle with (maybe) a 1/2 drop under the foil on the neck of the bottle.

For comparison, I felt the bottles in my wine rack at room temp, and they feel cool to the touch.

I have read the various postings (e.g. cork leakage, popped corks, boiling wine tastes like raisins, etc.), but I am still not clear as to whether I should be concerned. I have not opened any bottles, but I do not see signs of cork poppage (that is a word, right?).

So I am left here wondering whether I should be concerned and whether this warrants a call to service. At what point does heat become a problem? (As I do not intend to drink all 9 this evening - or even this month - I SPIDERS! GET THEM OFF! to discover a problem 1-2 yrs from now.)

Any thoughts?

Not sure where the "I SPIDERS! Get them off" came from...funny though. The K Vitner label does look like there are spiders on it...

chipandstephanie wrote:More on a common question today -

Two shipments arrived today at the same time, both from the last woot-off: K Vitners Syrah (3 bottles)and the Ty Canton Cab(6 bottles).

The K Vitners bottles were warm to the touch - not hot, but warm enough for me to notice. The Tys are also warm, but not as much. (The Tys had freezer packets, the K Vitners did not.) Upon close inspection, all corks / foil appear fine (did not remove foil), except for 1 Ty bottle with (maybe) a 1/2 drop under the foil on the neck of the bottle.

For comparison, I felt the bottles in my wine rack at room temp, and they feel cool to the touch.

I have read the various postings (e.g. cork leakage, popped corks, boiling wine tastes like raisins, etc.), but I am still not clear as to whether I should be concerned. I have not opened any bottles, but I do not see signs of cork poppage (that is a word, right?).

So I am left here wondering whether I should be concerned and whether this warrants a call to service. At what point does heat become a problem? (As I do not intend to drink all 9 this evening - or even this month - I SPIDERS! GET THEM OFF! to discover a problem 1-2 yrs from now.)

Any thoughts?

the foil caps should spin relatively freely on most wines (but not all), if it feels sticky, take the cap off and inspect, if you've got leakage, it's gotten too hot and you should e-mail service@woot.com.

if you don't have any outward signs of heat damage you're probably fine, wine is actually pretty durable.

The SPIDERS! GET THEM OFF! is a word filter for "do not want".

FWIW...Got my K Vintners Syrah today here in OHIO. Neutral temp to the touch so I don't foresee any problems. They arrived in the pressed cardboard liners. That's it, just waiting for rats on the current offer. Later.

MERCHANT wrote:
~snipped the beginning~
The question is this: Should foils be removed upon receipt? Does removing a foil prior to storage adversely affect the wine either short term or long term?

Good questions I haven't seen, yet alone answered.
I'd guess the foil helps keep out oxygen, thus keeping the cork somewhat moist(or from drying out), and possibly helping with long time storage... esp in not-so-ideal conditions.
???

WHERE THE HELL ARE THE RATS?!?!?!

There should be one more chardonnay rat (2 reports to come) and three merlot rats... come out come out, and hurry your asses up.

canonizer wrote:cooked wine =/= corked wine

No, I said "cooked" because I live in South Florida and the wine had burst through the cork. If it was hot enough to cook the merlot, I may have three casualties on my hands (not to mention the replacement GunBun merlot and the Ty Catons, which are even now awaiting me at the UPS center).

Comments on a couple of issues. Maybe you should have two shipping rates one for those of local to No. Calif and another for those at a distance so you can use the styrofoam shippers. Just an idea.

Regarding the foils. They are basically just for decoration. They do not affect the passage of air in or out of the bottle. If my memory serves me correct they were originally developed because in cellars of old, rats and mice and other critters would chew through the corks. Putting the foil on keeps them out. Some wineries have used wax to seal their bottles and I have seen some just use a little metal/plastic disc on the top of the cork for decoration. So you can take the foil off and the wine will age just fine.

In my some 40 yrs of wine drinking and previously in the wine business I would not take a wine that had just spent several days on a truck and try to taste it "right off the truck". I have always let it "rest" for a few days. From my experience it does make a difference.

The fact that the Merlot tasted better the second day when chilled points out why it is usually recommended to drink wine at cellar or room temperature. This means for red wines in the 50s or low 60s. Remember wine is made from a fruit and how many fruits do you know that taste better warm than cool or chilled?

kylemittskus wrote:WHERE THE HELL ARE THE RATS?!?!?!

There should be one more chardonnay rat (2 reports to come) and three merlot rats... come out come out, and hurry your asses up.

I was one of the rats and the chardonnay came with the merlot (short week and all). I chose to report on the merlot first as I received them together on Thursday and the chard was not available by then. I finished off the merlot and may open the chard tonight but even if I do, you probably won't hear from me until Saturday

**Lab rat report
It's great to be chosen as a lab rat as I love merlot and my wife thank you too.

This is my initial report and will have more comments later. I have a fellow wooter next door who is going to try it as well.

I tried this wine at room temp and also at a nice 65 degrees. I am going to try this at 58 degrees later as well.
Room temp taste:
* After pouring the wine, I observed the color. Right off the bat, you can tell that its not purple or a dark red. It was medium color and had a nice garnet/ruby tone. It has nice legs. ;)
*For the nose, I got cherry (full blown), chocolate (cocoa), tobacco, (maybe some oak
Taste: Tannins were mellow, alcohol was apparent but not unexpected due to the approaching 15% rating, but didn't bother me. Smooth & pleasant aftertaste. This wine kept me wanting more. I put the wine in the cellar for a few hours to bring down the temp and found myself wanting to pour more!
This wine does really drink like a cab, but a merlot for sure. I really enjoy cab and merlot and usually like a merlot that is big and a rich flavor.
Drinking this wine with a cooler temp improved the taste, but I liked it both ways. I tried it with my Venturi and didnt notice a change.
This wine will be good for a drinker with friends, light summer fare, Italian food, cheeses and fruit. (Wife says with seafood or meat) A good summer wine to boot!
I wanted to get something out quick since so many people are waiting for the reports from the rats. I will report additional comments later after I have my fellow woot testers come over and also after the wine has sat overnight. Cheers!

Lab Rat Report on the Chardonnay

Let me first say it has been a great honor to be chosen as a Rat. Thank you WOOT and WineDavid

I drank the merlot last night and this evening but I know allot of folks wanted to hear about the Backyard Chard. I just opened the Chard and after a few tastes I decided I had to post tonight. It was in the 'fridge for about 4 hours before I opened it. It’s good, a little sweet for my tastes but my wife liked it and that says a lot. Mild, fruity (Grape all the way), and very drinkable. Don’t put a lot in your glass though, if it warms up too much it gets a slightly bitter taste near the end

CTmasterblender wrote:I don't have the same amount of direct shipping that someone like Mazzocco has. I have no winery to visit and no tasting room. My sales in the last year in Missouri didn't add up to the cost and the time it took to license in the state, so I didn't renew - I'm sure you can relate to that. Every Winery will be different.

I completely understand, but I'm still disappointed. I enjoyed the Rooftop Red and Skinny Dip SB from August of '07, and was looking forward to trying these. Now I know how those who live in nanny states feel.

jaykid007 wrote:**Lab rat report
It's great to be chosen as a lab rat as I love merlot and my wife thank you too.

This is my initial report and will have more comments later. I have a fellow wooter next door who is going to try it as well.

I tried this wine at room temp and also at a nice 65 degrees. I am going to try this at 58 degrees later as well.
Room temp taste:
* After pouring the wine, I observed the color. Right off the bat, you can tell that its not purple or a dark red. It was medium color and had a nice garnet/ruby tone. It has nice legs. ;)
*For the nose, I got cherry (full blown), chocolate (cocoa), tobacco, (maybe some oak
Taste: Tannins were mellow, alcohol was apparent but not unexpected due to the approaching 15% rating, but didn't bother me. Smooth & pleasant aftertaste. This wine kept me wanting more. I put the wine in the cellar for a few hours to bring down the temp and found myself wanting to pour more!
This wine does really drink like a cab, but a merlot for sure. I really enjoy cab and merlot and usually like a merlot that is big and a rich flavor.
Drinking this wine with a cooler temp improved the taste, but I liked it both ways. I tried it with my Venturi and didnt notice a change.
This wine will be good for a drinker with friends, light summer fare, Italian food, cheeses and fruit. (Wife says with seafood or meat) A good summer wine to boot!
I wanted to get something out quick since so many people are waiting for the reports from the rats. I will report additional comments later after I have my fellow woot testers come over and also after the wine has sat overnight. Cheers!

This sounds like the Merlot I own. Thank you for the report. I agree with an earlier wooter that said it's nice that the rats are random to get a good cross section of tasters. I got a little bit of a laugh with the 42 degrees merlot tasting, but that is just me. My Mom, who has owned a winery for 25 years and lived in the Napa Valley for 34 years, still likes to put one ice cube in her glass of red wine in the summer. IT'S a Beverage and we are all entitled to our opinions and styles. I thank you both for your honest assessment of my wine. That is what make Woot so different then other venues.

deaconbluez wrote:I completely understand, but I'm still disappointed. I enjoyed the Rooftop Red and Skinny Dip SB from August of '07, and was looking forward to trying these. Now I know how those who live in nanny states feel.

I'm really sorry - I'm the last person that wants to turn down a sale right now. I even licensed myself in a few states for the Woot, but looking back two years ago the sales weren't there. Please feel free to call me about other avenues 707-965-3694, I would be happy to chat about it. Thanks Trent

CREIGHTONatNY wrote:Lab Rat Report on the Chardonnay

Let me first say it has been a great honor to be chosen as a Rat. Thank you WOOT and WineDavid

I drank the merlot last night and this evening but I know allot of folks wanted to hear about the Backyard Chard. I just opened the Chard and after a few tastes I decided I had to post tonight. It was in the 'fridge for about 4 hours before I opened it. It’s good, a little sweet for my tastes but my wife liked it and that says a lot. Mild, fruity (Grape all the way), and very drinkable. Don’t put a lot in your glass though, if it warms up too much it gets a slightly bitter taste near the end

Glad you tried the Chard tonight - you guys should get some kind of award for being the first Rat on both the Chard and the Merlot!!! I guess the Chard doesn't matter now because it's sold out, but I like to have the reports because I really believe these are quality wines and when you are running with a Negociant label, all you have is your reputation. I can never offer consistency, but what I feel I can excel in is Quality. Thank you again for posting both the wines. Information only, the chardonnay is completely dry, I wasn't sure if you were using the sweet as a descriptor or literal. I use it as a descriptor all the time.

2005 NAPA Valley Front Porch Merlot
Current numbers (updated each minute)
First sucker: vwap
Speed to first woot: 0m -20.-803s
Last wooter to woot: wezgray

This is my third wine.woot -- with many more to come. I can not wait to try...

Collegebob wrote:Comments on a couple of issues. Maybe you should have two shipping rates one for those of local to No. Calif and another for those at a distance so you can use the styrofoam shippers. Just an idea.

Regarding the foils. They are basically just for decoration. They do not affect the passage of air in or out of the bottle. If my memory serves me correct they were originally developed because in cellars of old, rats and mice and other critters would chew through the corks. Putting the foil on keeps them out. Some wineries have used wax to seal their bottles and I have seen some just use a little metal/plastic disc on the top of the cork for decoration. So you can take the foil off and the wine will age just fine.

In my some 40 yrs of wine drinking and previously in the wine business I would not take a wine that had just spent several days on a truck and try to taste it "right off the truck". I have always let it "rest" for a few days. From my experience it does make a difference.

The fact that the Merlot tasted better the second day when chilled points out why it is usually recommended to drink wine at cellar or room temperature. This means for red wines in the 50s or low 60s. Remember wine is made from a fruit and how many fruits do you know that taste better warm than cool or chilled?

Your foil comments are right on, but it goes a little further. The BATF requires that you have the cork covered to show original seal, but it really has nothing to do with the wine. As for the bottle shock, it is real, but to what extent is the real question. You would not believe (well maybe the poster does seeing that he was in the business) what wine goes through before you see it. I had an East Coast distributor that always used rail to get their wines and only shipping when they had a full container - 22 pallets, 56 per pallet. What I later found out and why I'm not with them any more is that the car was NOT temp controlled! They figured the wine on the inside was fine and the outer boxes would get a little cooked. Think about this, a rail takes a couple weeks - Fed EX and UPS take 3 to 6 days ground. Wine is very resilient, I'm not saying that I like my wine mistreated, but what I am saying is that a lot of the wine you drink off the shelf say sub $15 is been through more then you think. Wine pushing through the cork is not good depending on how it happens. If you run into an old Burgundy with mold on the top of the cork and you don't want to drink it, I will send you my FedEx number. Wine leakage can happen at bottling and does all the time. If you buy a mag from me, most will have wine on the top of the cork becuase the bottling line won't handle the tall bottles so I have to hand cork. When you push the cork in wine comes up a lot of the time. LONG rant!

andyduncan wrote:Oh no, I saw those, but I figure if we bug SB enough he'll cave.

If you think it would help the cause, I'll tell him he shouldn't and break out the angel and devil woot-icons again...

-- T

jaykid007 wrote:**Lab rat report
It's great to be chosen as a lab rat as I love merlot and my wife thank you too.

This is my initial report and will have more comments later. I have a fellow wooter next door who is going to try it as well.

I tried this wine at room temp and also at a nice 65 degrees. I am going to try this at 58 degrees later as well.
Room temp taste:
* After pouring the wine, I observed the color. Right off the bat, you can tell that its not purple or a dark red. It was medium color and had a nice garnet/ruby tone. It has nice legs. ;)
*For the nose, I got cherry (full blown), chocolate (cocoa), tobacco, (maybe some oak
Taste: Tannins were mellow, alcohol was apparent but not unexpected due to the approaching 15% rating, but didn't bother me. Smooth & pleasant aftertaste. This wine kept me wanting more. I put the wine in the cellar for a few hours to bring down the temp and found myself wanting to pour more!
This wine does really drink like a cab, but a merlot for sure. I really enjoy cab and merlot and usually like a merlot that is big and a rich flavor.
Drinking this wine with a cooler temp improved the taste, but I liked it both ways. I tried it with my Venturi and didnt notice a change.
This wine will be good for a drinker with friends, light summer fare, Italian food, cheeses and fruit. (Wife says with seafood or meat) A good summer wine to boot!
I wanted to get something out quick since so many people are waiting for the reports from the rats. I will report additional comments later after I have my fellow woot testers come over and also after the wine has sat overnight. Cheers!

Thanks for the notes. Money is tight at the moment but I'm thinking (hoping) that this is a deal that I don't want to miss. Looking forward to hearing from more rats. Where is everybody?

A little off topic now, but I would like to put together a tasting for some non wine drinkers and was wondering if anyone had suggestions for specific wines that would be solid examples of the common varietals that would be comparable across the board so that people can get an idea of how the varietals differ from one another and if they have a preference.

Rat reporting in.

First impressions are good, although as previously noted I'm not typically a merlot fan. I could see those who are enjoying this, though. Definitely recommend drinking it chilled a few degrees below room temperature, as it can be a little oppressive at room temp.

I'll finish the rest of it tomorrow for a full opinion, but even with my reservations I think the QPR on this is very strong. Definitely not sad I went in for 3

mierdaan wrote:Rat reporting in.

First impressions are good, although as previously noted I'm not typically a merlot fan. I could see those who are enjoying this, though. Definitely recommend drinking it chilled a few degrees below room temperature, as it can be a little oppressive at room temp.

I'll finish the rest of it tomorrow for a full opinion, but even with my reservations I think the QPR on this is very strong. Definitely not sad I went in for 3

I wish I went in for 3! My fellow wooter next door and his girlfriend came over and really enjoyed the merlot as well. The first comment was " It drinks like a cab!" and she isn't on woot. Only he is. But got good positive feedback from both.

houghton145 wrote:Thanks for the notes. Money is tight at the moment but I'm thinking (hoping) that this is a deal that I don't want to miss. Looking forward to hearing from more rats. Where is everybody?

A little off topic now, but I would like to put together a tasting for some non wine drinkers and was wondering if anyone had suggestions for specific wines that would be solid examples of the common varietals that would be comparable across the board so that people can get an idea of how the varietals differ from one another and if they have a preference.

Y'all may disagree, but I've found that Bogle is a good representation of the varietals that I've tried, and very reasonably priced. However, you're not going to get a 'killer' wine.

andyduncan wrote:the foil caps should spin relatively freely on most wines (but not all), if it feels sticky, take the cap off and inspect, if you've got leakage, it's gotten too hot and you should e-mail service@woot.com.

if you don't have any outward signs of heat damage you're probably fine, wine is actually pretty durable.

Big thanks to andyduncan - I checked the all nine foils. All but 4 spin freely (1-2 after a little resistance). 4 however, were tight enough to remove the foil and check...

Of the 4 with foils removed, 3 check out fine...

1 bottle (a Ty Cab) is toast - the cork is completely soaked on top (I expected this, as I looked more closely at the bottle and found the residue from drippage all over the bottle).

So...I will email service for a replacement, BUT
I need to know whether I should be concerned about the whole shipment or just the 1 bottle showing distress.

The two competing thoughts appear to be (1) wine is resilient, therefore no distress = no worries; and (2) they all traveled together - if one went down, they all went down.

Sage words of wisdom????

chipandstephanie wrote:Big thanks to andyduncan - I checked the all nine foils. All but 4 spin freely (1-2 after a little resistance). 4 however, were tight enough to remove the foil and check...

Of the 4 with foils removed, 3 check out fine...

1 bottle (a Ty Cab) is toast - the cork is completely soaked on top (I expected this, as I looked more closely at the bottle and found the residue from drippage all over the bottle).

So...I will email service for a replacement, BUT
I need to know whether I should be concerned about the whole shipment or just the 1 bottle showing distress.

The two competing thoughts appear to be (1) wine is resilient, therefore no distress = no worries; and (2) they all traveled together - if one went down, they all went down.

Sage words of wisdom????

As a Science teacher, I'd say there's nothing like a little experimentation! Try one of the 'good' ones and see if it's good.

Hey!!! My square's BLACK...when did that happen? Perhaps I should ease up on the wine drinking......Just Kidding!

randysanders wrote:Y'all may disagree, but I've found that Bogle is a good representation of the varietals that I've tried, and very reasonably priced. However, you're not going to get a 'killer' wine.

Wouldn't disagree at all - their Old Vine Zin is a great standby favorite of mine as far as supermarket wines go.

CTmasterblender wrote:Your foil comments are right on, but it goes a little further. The BATF requires that you have the cork covered to show original seal, but it really has nothing to do with the wine. As for the bottle shock, it is real, but to what extent is the real question. You would not believe (well maybe the poster does seeing that he was in the business) what wine goes through before you see it. I had an East Coast distributor that always used rail to get their wines and only shipping when they had a full container - 22 pallets, 56 per pallet. What I later found out and why I'm not with them any more is that the car was NOT temp controlled! They figured the wine on the inside was fine and the outer boxes would get a little cooked. Think about this, a rail takes a couple weeks - Fed EX and UPS take 3 to 6 days ground. Wine is very resilient, I'm not saying that I like my wine mistreated, but what I am saying is that a lot of the wine you drink off the shelf say sub $15 is been through more then you think. Wine pushing through the cork is not good depending on how it happens. If you run into an old Burgundy with mold on the top of the cork and you don't want to drink it, I will send you my FedEx number. Wine leakage can happen at bottling and does all the time. If you buy a mag from me, most will have wine on the top of the cork becuase the bottling line won't handle the tall bottles so I have to hand cork. When you push the cork in wine comes up a lot of the time. LONG rant!

I don't see it as a "LONG rant"...just great info that makes us a little more wootelligent...and maybe help us decide to press the button!!

Darn...did I just coin a new word for this site??? ""Wootelligent...intelligent woot information!

jaykid007 wrote:I wish I went in for 3! My fellow wooter next door and his girlfriend came over and really enjoyed the merlot as well. The first comment was " It drinks like a cab!" and she isn't on woot. Only he is. But got good positive feedback from both.

Can someone point me to an explanation about why "drinks like a cab" is a good thing?

I'm associating it with "wow, I thought you were a woman but now you feel like a man" - and the best I can say for that is it's an improvement on Java, Sparky or Bowtie talking about their g-strings or taking a shower in the pub threads.

-- T

chipandstephanie wrote:Big thanks to andyduncan - I checked the all nine foils. All but 4 spin freely (1-2 after a little resistance). 4 however, were tight enough to remove the foil and check...

Of the 4 with foils removed, 3 check out fine...

1 bottle (a Ty Cab) is toast - the cork is completely soaked on top (I expected this, as I looked more closely at the bottle and found the residue from drippage all over the bottle).

So...I will email service for a replacement, BUT
I need to know whether I should be concerned about the whole shipment or just the 1 bottle showing distress.

The two competing thoughts appear to be (1) wine is resilient, therefore no distress = no worries; and (2) they all traveled together - if one went down, they all went down.

Sage words of wisdom????

A big Thanks to andyduncan too... I received Goosecross, K Vinters and Ty Caton yesterday. All 3 of the Ty Caton Cabs were leaking and cooked. So I decided to take the foil off the other 2 shipments and they are just fine.