kylemittskus


quality posts: 229 Private Messages kylemittskus
MarkDaSpark wrote:Exactly. The problem is that one side is presenting TM as still this 12 year old innocent, when he wasn't. And ignoring other things that indicate GZ wasn't a rabid racist.



+1

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
MarkDaSpark wrote:Exactly. The problem is that one side is presenting TM as still this 12 year old innocent, when he wasn't. And ignoring other things that indicate GZ wasn't a rabid racist.


-1

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 174 Private Messages MarkDaSpark
chipgreen wrote:-1



Yes, don't let the truth bother you. I'm not saying GZ is totally innocent, but neither is he totally guilty.

And where was this angst when a black man shot and killed a white teenager and was acquitted of Manslaughter? Or about Joshua Chellew? I don't see President Obama saying anything about it.

Or others beaten in the name of TM for being White?


And the family that GZ helped save from their burning car is afraid to say anything positive about him, for fear of retaliation.


Instead of healing us, Obama, Holder, Sharpton, et al are dividing us.


Edit: Or maybe Obama is following in that fine Hawaiian tradition of "Beat Haole" day?


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

rjquillin


quality posts: 170 Private Messages rjquillin
MarkDaSpark wrote:Yes, don't let the truth bother you.
Instead of healing us, Obama, Holder, Sharpton, et al are dividing us.

+1
I really should stay outta here.
This entire event was handled so poorly in the press it's disgusting.

I'm not "in" SD, just too close, but can we talk about SD's mayor?
He's a true work of art.

CT

mother


quality posts: 15 Private Messages mother
rjquillin wrote:+1
I really should stay outta here.
This entire event was handled so poorly in the press it's disgusting.

I'm not "in" SD, just too close, but can we talk about SD's mayor?
He's a true work of art.



Or Weiner's weiner?

chemvictim


quality posts: 3 Private Messages chemvictim

SD mayor, Weiner, what the hell is wrong with these guys?

Can we blame their upbringing? Nobody ever told them "no" when they were kids? Something?

A guy who's not in charge of himself should not be in charge of a city.

rjquillin


quality posts: 170 Private Messages rjquillin
mother wrote:Or Weiner's weiner?

"funny" thing here, it's not lust of the weiner, this guy is 70, but pure blind lust for power. Intimidating and total power, and his party KNEW IT all along, but kept quiet, for the most part. There was a brief disclosure during the primary by one of the assaulted that was all too quickly dismissed and covered up; all in the quest for total control and power for the party. And now these same pols have the balls, even the women, to come out against him. They are every bit as culpable themselves for allowing this to continue for years while remaining virtually silent. Not only should he step down, not a chance in hell of that happening, but every stinking one of them should all be recalled.
/rant

[edit] rant
And...
one of the local AM talkers was organizing a recall effort, non-paid signatures, after a filing is made for a recall effort there is a total of 39 days allowed for collection of sigs. So he was getting things all lined up for a hopefully successful blitz. What happens? Some LGBT tool that supports Filner goes and makes a filing to start the clock!

//rant

CT

chemvictim


quality posts: 3 Private Messages chemvictim
rjquillin wrote:"funny" thing here, it's not lust of the weiner, this guy is 70, but pure blind lust for power. Intimidating and total power, and his party KNEW IT all along, but kept quiet, for the most part. There was a brief disclosure during the primary by one of the assaulted that was all too quickly dismissed and covered up; all in the quest for total control and power for the party. And now these same pols have the balls, even the women, to come out against him. They are every bit as culpable themselves for allowing this to continue for years while remaining virtually silent. Not only should he step down, not a chance in hell of that happening, but every stinking one of them should all be recalled.
/rant

[edit] rant
And...
one of the local AM talkers was organizing a recall effort, non-paid signatures, after a filing is made for a recall effort there is a total of 39 days allowed for collection of sigs. So he was getting things all lined up for a hopefully successful blitz. What happens? Some LGBT tool that supports Filner goes and makes a filing to start the clock!

//rant



Just what I've read about this guy in the last 5 minutes makes my skin crawl. Rehab? Please.

kylemittskus


quality posts: 229 Private Messages kylemittskus
MarkDaSpark wrote:Yes, don't let the truth bother you. I'm not saying GZ is totally innocent, but neither is he totally guilty...

Instead of healing us, Obama, Holder, Sharpton, et al are dividing us.



It is really rare when Sparky and I agree on an issue completely but I think this may be one.

GZ was certainly not innocent but neither was TM. It's sad TM died. No question. It's sad it happened at all, but this wasn't a one-sided, prejudice-motivated crime. He didn't kill TM because he was black. Prejudice-motivated crimes happen all the time -- they happen in circles that are divided by things other than race, and we hear NOTHING from it, let alone the crimes that are committed due to race.

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 174 Private Messages MarkDaSpark
kylemittskus wrote:It is really rare when Sparky and I agree on an issue completely but I think this may be one.

GZ was certainly not innocent but neither was TM. It's sad TM died. No question. It's sad it happened at all, but this wasn't a one-sided, prejudice-motivated crime. He didn't kill TM because he was black. Prejudice-motivated crimes happen all the time -- they happen in circles that are divided by things other than race, and we hear NOTHING from it, let alone the crimes that are committed due to race.



I think you left them speechless!


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

kylemittskus


quality posts: 229 Private Messages kylemittskus
MarkDaSpark wrote:I think you left them speechless!



Ha!

"If drinking is bitter, change yourself to wine." -Rainer Maria Rilke

"Champagne is a very kind and friendly thing on a rainy night." -Isak Dinesen

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen

The only racial aspect in my mind is that GZ targeted TM as "suspicious" based on his color. The rest of the events as they unfolded had nothing to do with race but the incident was precipitated by racial profiling.

That said, I'm not totally against racial (or ethnic, or gender) profiling. If previous break-ins in the neighborhood were committed by young black men then GZ was right to have heightened suspicions about an unknown young black male in the vicinity. He called the police to report it, exactly as he should have done but then he crossed the line by getting out his vehicle to pursue TM on foot against the direction of the police dispatcher. That's where everything started to go wrong.

The rest is history and GZ should be in jail for manslaughter or at the very least negligent homicide (why was that not an option?).

I don't care if it was Charles Manson walking home with a bag of Gobstoppers, he shouldn't wind up dead because of some overzealous cop-wannabe.

bhodilee


quality posts: 32 Private Messages bhodilee

NM, should read a whole post before going on a rant.

internet 101

Anyway, here's a story about why gun control and birth control may be two sides of the same coin.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."

– George Bernard Shaw, author (1856-1950)

chemvictim


quality posts: 3 Private Messages chemvictim
bhodilee wrote:NM, should read a whole post before going on a rant.

internet 101

Anyway, here's a story about why gun control and birth control may be two sides of the same coin.





I want to read the rant.

klezman


quality posts: 119 Private Messages klezman
bhodilee wrote:NM, should read a whole post before going on a rant.

internet 101

Anyway, here's a story about why gun control and birth control may be two sides of the same coin.



Rants are fun, but prospective Darwin Award winners are always welcome.

2014: 28 bottles. Last wine.woot: Scott Harvey Red Re-Mix
2013: 66 bottles, 2012: 91 bottles, 2011: 92 bottles, 2010: 74 bottles, 2009: 30 bottles, 2008: 3 bottles My CT

bhodilee


quality posts: 32 Private Messages bhodilee

So this thread has been dead:

So, from my Facebook:

Huge run on teachers banging students recently, mostly female teachers at that.

As the principal (or whoever hires), has it gotten to the point where you shy away from young, physically attractive female teachers? One of the people that works at my kid's daycare didn't get a job recently and I thought, did they not hire her solely because she's young and pretty? If so, that'd be a shame, but I completely understand. I wonder if this is almost becoming a badge of honor among high school boys?

So, is it a good reason to turn someone down for a job? Extension of Iowa's too pretty work law? I don't know.

I think it sucks, but if it happens I completely understand. You don't know the person you're interviewing and if they may be susceptible to this, so just don't hire them and expose your school to the embarrassment and litigation that it may involve.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."

– George Bernard Shaw, author (1856-1950)

chemvictim


quality posts: 3 Private Messages chemvictim

Bowtie proposes only hiring ugly women as teachers so the students won't have sex with them. I made some comments about unfairness, etc. but here is the real issue. Almost all high school principals are men.

Good luck convincing them not to hire the pretty young thang.

At my high school, I don't recall any scandals about boys sleeping with their teachers, but some of the male teachers slept with female students. In one case, they eventually got married.

This might end up as a double post, woot is being mean to me.

bhodilee


quality posts: 32 Private Messages bhodilee
chemvictim wrote:Bowtie proposes only hiring ugly women as teachers so the students won't have sex with them. I made some comments about unfairness, etc. but here is the real issue. Almost all high school principals are men.

Good luck convincing them not to hire the pretty young thang.

At my high school, I don't recall any scandals about boys sleeping with their teachers, but some of the male teachers slept with female students. In one case, they eventually got married.

This might end up as a double post, woot is being mean to me.



I'm not saying it doesn't happen both ways, just that lately in the news it's been mainly female teachers (and in general this seems to be reported on way more than it used to, remember how big a scandal Letourneau was? Now you don't even hear about it). And as a principal making a hiring decision, does that factor into it? I bet it does. Should it? No, but I bet it does and I understand why it does, even if I don't necessarily agree with it.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."

– George Bernard Shaw, author (1856-1950)

ERMD


quality posts: 1 Private Messages ERMD

But is this not profiling ?

rjquillin


quality posts: 170 Private Messages rjquillin

[Go woot! filters here]

Italian vintners sell popular line of bottles glorifying I wanted you guys to know I'm ignorants and other dictators.

The Simon Wiesenthal Center is urging wine distributors to boycott Italian wine-makers Vina Lunardelli for selling a line of I wanted you guys to know I'm ignorant and fascist branded wines
LINKY

Just not sure what to say on this one, other than I'm with strongly with Wiesenthal.

CT

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
rjquillin wrote:[Go woot! filters here]

Italian vintners sell popular line of bottles glorifying I wanted you guys to know I'm ignorants and other dictators.

The Simon Wiesenthal Center is urging wine distributors to boycott Italian wine-makers Vina Lunardelli for selling a line of I wanted you guys to know I'm ignorant and fascist branded wines
LINKY

Just not sure what to say on this one, other than I'm with strongly with Wiesenthal.


That seems more productive than chasing after 95 yr. old men who were forced to fight in a war 70 years ago.

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 174 Private Messages MarkDaSpark
chipgreen wrote:That seems more productive than chasing after 95 yr. old men who were forced to fight in a war 70 years ago.



Really? Next you'll be saying they were "only following orders"!


Be glad PetiteSirah is no longer hanging out here. Be very, very glad.


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

mother


quality posts: 15 Private Messages mother
chipgreen wrote:That seems more productive than chasing after 95 yr. old men who were forced to fight in a war 70 years ago.



So you're a racist and an anti-semite who practices holocaust denial... What else should we know about you?

mother


quality posts: 15 Private Messages mother
MarkDaSpark wrote:Really? Next you'll be saying they were "only following orders"!


Be glad PetiteSirah is no longer hanging out here. Be very, very glad.



I think Chipgreen probably doesn't get out much, which in his case is a very good thing.

rjquillin


quality posts: 170 Private Messages rjquillin
chipgreen wrote:That seems more productive than chasing after 95 yr. old men who were forced to fight in a war 70 years ago.

I'm rather hoping your "That seems..." is referring to the production and marketing of the topic wine...

It seems I should just avoid this forum.

CT

chemvictim


quality posts: 3 Private Messages chemvictim
rjquillin wrote:I'm rather hoping your "That seems..." is referring to the production and marketing of the topic wine...



That's what I was wondering. I thought maybe "that seems more productive" referred to the boycott. As in, the boycott is more productive than chasing after the old guys.

As for that, which old guys are you referring to, Chip? A specific person? All not-see soldiers? Were you being vague on purpose, to stir the pot? I think a few of us have assumed the worst.

edlada


quality posts: 3 Private Messages edlada
MarkDaSpark wrote:Really? Next you'll be saying they were "only following orders"!


Be glad PetiteSirah is no longer hanging out here. Be very, very glad.



A sure sign of the pending apocalypse, I agree with MDS on the Poli"ticks" thread!

My dogs like me, that is important.

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
mother wrote:So you're a racist and an anti-semite who practices holocaust denial... What else should we know about you?


Wow, make assumptions much? As a Clevelander who watched the John Demjanjuk situation play out (twice), let's just say that I have some cynicism towards the process of chasing war criminals 70 years after the fact.

Demjanjuk was convicted and spent 7+ years of a life sentence in an Israeli prison before it was proven that he was convicted with FORGED DOCUMENTS.

Then, decades later, he was convicted all over again but this time as a supposedly different person than he was supposed to be the first time ("Ivan the Terrible").

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
mother wrote:I think Chipgreen probably doesn't get out much, which in his case is a very good thing.


flunk you

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
rjquillin wrote:I'm rather hoping your "That seems..." is referring to the production and marketing of the topic wine...

It seems I should just avoid this forum.


Me too. Too many cyberbullies.

mother


quality posts: 15 Private Messages mother
chipgreen wrote:Me too. Too many cyberbullies.



(If we would just die and not make such a fuss...)

Just to clarify- are you leaving and the rest of us who twitch when we read w-t-f you've just posted can try staying?

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 174 Private Messages MarkDaSpark
chipgreen wrote:Wow, make assumptions much? As a Clevelander who watched the John Demjanjuk situation play out (twice), let's just say that I have some cynicism towards the process of chasing war criminals 70 years after the fact.

Demjanjuk was convicted and spent 7+ years of a life sentence in an Israeli prison before it was proven that he was convicted with FORGED DOCUMENTS.

Then, decades later, he was convicted all over again but this time as a supposedly different person than he was supposed to be the first time ("Ivan the Terrible").



Uh huh. I believe his victims ("accessory to the murder of 27,900 Jews") would disagree with you.


There's about 6 million victims that would also disagree with you.


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

mother


quality posts: 15 Private Messages mother
MarkDaSpark wrote:
There's about 6 million victims that would also disagree with you.



I think the number is 12-13 million in actuality.

MarkDaSpark


quality posts: 174 Private Messages MarkDaSpark
mother wrote:I think the number is 12-13 million in actuality.



Doh! You are correct sir!


Someone has to put WD's kids thru college, but why does it have to be me!
*This post is for purposes of enabling only, and does not constitute any promise of helping pay for said enabling. It does indicate willingness to assist in drinking said wine.

tytiger58


quality posts: 74 Private Messages tytiger58
chipgreen wrote:That seems more productive than chasing after 95 yr. old men who were forced to fight in a war 70 years ago.



I knew there was a reason I never look into this thread..sheez

What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch? ~ W. C. Fields

“Freedom is something that dies unless it's used” Hunter S Thompson




chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
tytiger58 wrote:I knew there was a reason I never look into this thread..sheez


Really, you don't think it's more productive to go after current-day proponents of N a z i i s m than to go after German soldiers from WWII using documents of questionable authenticity?

As mentioned in my followup post, I am cynical of the process that convicted John Demjanjuk twice for being two completely different people. Somebody forged documents to make it appear that he was Ivan the Terrible. It was later proven that the documents were fraudulent and he was not Ivan the Terrible. That doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the process but for me to question it suddenly turns me into some raging racist anti-semite holocaust denier? Talk about "sheez"!

Personally, I think anyone who denies the holocaust is loonier than a 9/11 conspiracy theorist but it's sad that I feel it necessary to state that on the record to deflect mother's baseless accusations.

I'm glad that the Simon Weisenthal Center is addressing current day issues and believe that they can do the most good by continuing those efforts.

mother


quality posts: 15 Private Messages mother

Seriously, just stop.

coynedj


quality posts: 7 Private Messages coynedj

As I'm sure we all know, there are many other threads and sites on the internet where one can discuss politics. And, as I'm sure we all know, most of those threads and sites are filled with name-calling, ad hominem attacks, and outright idiocy.

One of the reasons I participate in this thread is that it has a long history of being different. Here, we engage (for the most part) in thoughtful discussions among thoughtful people. Personal insults toward fellow wooters should not be a part of that, at least in my opinion.

A point of view was stated, and rather than "why do you say that?" or "here's why I disagree", slanderous accusations were made instead. I ask that a generous civility be observed here. I'm not a moderator, only a participant, so please treat this as a request rather than a demand.

I started out on Burgundy but soon hit the harder stuff. Bob Dylan, Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues

How on earth did I get 7 QPs?

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
chemvictim wrote:That's what I was wondering. I thought maybe "that seems more productive" referred to the boycott. As in, the boycott is more productive than chasing after the old guys.



Yes, that's exactly what I was saying.

chemvictim wrote:As for that, which old guys are you referring to, Chip? A specific person? All not-see soldiers? Were you being vague on purpose, to stir the pot? I think a few of us have assumed the worst.


Thank you for questioning rather than accusing. I had no intention of stirring the pot but I should have stopped to consider the sensitivity of the subject matter before typing what I thought was a rather innocent comment. I can see how, without context or background, it could be misconstrued.

chipgreen


quality posts: 179 Private Messages chipgreen
mother wrote:Seriously, just stop.


Maybe, when you apologize for what you called me.